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PG vs VG

Discussion in 'Beginners' started by Gabby, Oct 26, 2016.

  1. Gabby

    Gabby Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2016
    Location:
    Adelaide
    I'm sure this has been hacked around here a lot, but I'm a newbie and I'm after some simple explanations. I'm very much an MTL vaper and I'm not into cloud chasing or experimenting.

    Noe's list suggests buying PG only juices (mainly) and Heavengifts seems to sell mainly PG only or VG only or 70/30. Some other sites mainly sell 50/50.

    So what are the pros & cons of using only PG or only VG in my situation? Or varying the mix for that matter?
     
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  2. Charles Vaper

    Charles Vaper Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2015
    Location:
    Gladesville, NSW, Australia
    Hi there, Gabby.

    Here's what you need to know... PG is a flavour carrier meaning that flavours will be more pronounced when mixed in PG as apposed to VG. PG also provides us with throat hit, (the sensation of the smoke passing through our mouth into our lungs). VG is sweeter and some consider it a safer or more pure alternative.

    e liquids made with 100 % VG do not generally offer as much flavour as PG however, most manufacturers will utilise a variety of additives to compensate and or, longer steep time (ageing, much line wine) VG offers a lot of vapour too, far more than PG.

    The choice of what to use is purely trial and error however, I prefer to use a 30/70 blend. (30 % PG) Some vapers, myself included, get a slight irritation from higher PG percentages.
     
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  3. emu

    emu Banned

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    Location:
    Chorkerup Rd W.A
    PG is a thin liquid like water and seems to be good for carrying flavor as well as wetting the wick easier than VG, VG is very thick liquid and tends to make a lot more cloud than PG.
    Some coils have trouble absorbing high VG juices which increases the risk of getting a burnt taste, on the other hand some tanks will leak if the VG is to low.

    It's a matter of finding the right balance between the two that tastes good and performs well for the particular set up you are using, comes down to personal choice in the end although finding your happy place can take a while and a bit of experimenting.
    A lot of folks start with 50/50 PG/VG and go from there, PG gives more of a throat hit not unlike the feeling of inhaling the smoke from a cig.

    I'm a MTL vaper and I like 80% VG because VG is sweet and I like clouds but I use unflavoured juice so I don't need the PG for flavour.
     
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  4. Noe

    Noe Adorably quirky ... QUIRKY Noe! VCA Approved Post Whore

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    Or simply add more flavor concentrate to compensate, which is the usual method employed & why I don't particularly like the idea of high VG juice, since flavor is the ingredient that carries most health risk in juice.

    I find too much VG in my juice makes my lungs feel tight & if I don't drop the VG% down, after a while I get pain in the chest with high VG juice.
    So I generally do not use more than 50% VG in my juice, usually I aim for a 70/30 or 60/40 PG/VG blend.

    The juices I recommend & provide links to, in "Noe's List" are 70/30 PG/VG based, this ratio is known to work very well in the devices also listed in "Noe's List".
    However 50/50 PG/VG juice should also work in them, they may struggle with higher VG blends like a 30/70 PG/VG.

    Ultimately, if you are a new vaper, then it is going to take some experimentation to discover the PG/VG ratio you prefer but starting with juice that provides good flavor helps when making the transition from smoking.
     
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  5. Judith

    Judith Mostly harmless

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    Gabby has asthma so is probably better off with 50/50 or higher VG.
     
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  6. Pippi

    Pippi Admin Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2015
    Location:
    Victoria
    My diy mix is currently 70/30 VG/PG . I am not a cloud chaser (unless under the influence of Vino) Thinking of going back down to 50/50 as I really dislike the sweetness of VG. Really its kinda trial and error to find what works for you.
    Everyone will have a different opinion and the best thing is to set yourself up with some basic juice making gear and have a play. I know you said you didnt want to experiment - I didnt either but haven't looked back since I had a go with help from good people here.
    It seems daunting but actually its very easy and the wise ones here would help you with that.
     
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  7. Noe

    Noe Adorably quirky ... QUIRKY Noe! VCA Approved Post Whore

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    50/50 will work with the devices in Noe's List, so that wouldn't be a problem.
    Mixing a 70/30 PG/VG juice with a 30/70 PG/VG juice will make a 50/50 PG/VG juice & would work best if using the same flavor from both bottles.

    The VG based juices on HeavenGifts are limited for flavors though:
    http://www.heavengifts.com/30ml-Dekang-VG-e-juice-e-liquid.html
    So I'd suggest using vanilla VG based juice to pair with the PG based flavors, vanilla will work with most other flavors & give a slightly creamy note to them.
     
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  8. Pippi

    Pippi Admin Moderator

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    Victoria
    Maybe put the link to Noe's list?
     
  9. Noe

    Noe Adorably quirky ... QUIRKY Noe! VCA Approved Post Whore

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    LOL it's in my post before that one.
     
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  10. Gabby

    Gabby Member

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    Sep 3, 2016
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Thanks everyone. I'm used to conflicting advice, and it all helps.
    The way I see it at the moment is that as an MTL non-cloud chaser I should probably stick to around 50/50 until I find a good reason to change, some of which is discussed above.
    Of my 3 juices at the moment I find 2 of them a bit too strong flavoured (vanilla and banana bread). The banana bread is also 24mg which I'm starting to feel is a bit nic-strong too (I prefer 18mg). So I could sort my current issues getting some bottles of VG & HG, base & 18mg unflavoured, and mix them myself. Not too much effort or cost, but it seems like a lot of bottles - I make it 4 bottles + some mixing eqt.
    Sound like a plan?
     
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  11. Noe

    Noe Adorably quirky ... QUIRKY Noe! VCA Approved Post Whore

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    If the 24mg/ml banana bread is too high in nic content, then you could add some plain VG to it to make it 18mg/ml.
    You can buy 100% plain VG from health food stores "Melrose" brand is one I have used in the past & is very good. 200ml will be about $7 - $8 & goes a long way, if you want it quickly & don't already have some.
    To make it 18mg/ml, mix 3ml of juice to 1ml of vg = 4ml in total, this will also reduce the flavor strength by 25% & increase the VG in the PG/VG ratio giving you almost a 50/50 PG/VG mix (probably more like 51/49).
    (If you have some plain VG or if you can buy some from a health food store this should be your first plan)

    You could then go with your plan of getting some 18mg/ml unflavored nic, if you try some 50/50 juice first & decide that is what you prefer for a ratio & your juices are 70/30 PG/VG then get some 18mg in 30/70 PG/VG (or 25/75 is close) for mixing & your juices will work out at 50/50 after mixing 1:1 but you will lose half of the flavor.
    Personally, I think if you are going to go to all the trouble of that, then you may as well go a step further & buy flavor concentrates, 36mg/ml nicotine & some plain PG & VG, then mix your own juices to the flavor strength you prefer. Then by using 50% 36mg/ml nic & 50% PG/VG/concentrate(all combined) you can make juice that is 18mg/ml, in the PG/VG ratio you prefer & with as much flavor as you prefer.
     
  12. emu

    emu Banned

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    Sounds like a great plan Gabby, if you happen to get the 18mg unflavoured give it a try on it's own you might be surprised how good it is without flavour.
     
  13. Gasman

    Gasman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2015
    Location:
    Northern suburbs, Perth
    After more than 3 years of vaping I'm still jumping around with my PG/VG % but have definitely settled on above 20mg nic.

    I simply find myself craving a vape more with lower nic. I certainly don't want clouds but do enjoy the throat hit so my choice seems obvious but .....

    Not much help I know but I'm sure you'll find what you're searching.
     
  14. Gabby

    Gabby Member

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    Sep 3, 2016
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    Adelaide
    On Heavengifts I see that for CN E-Packet it states "Cannot ship e-liquid or batteries from May 25, 2016." Anyone tried this since June? If not CN E-Packet, what's the most cost effective shipping option?
     
  15. Noe

    Noe Adorably quirky ... QUIRKY Noe! VCA Approved Post Whore

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    Netherlands Airmail would be cheapest but it may first go to Europe before being sent here, so it may take up to 6 weeks for delivery. I have not personally used NL post & don't know anyone that has from HG but I do know of other vapers that have used NL post from other Chinese vendors & they experienced longer than usual(compared to Singapore Post or China post etc) wait times for delivery .

    It may be cheaper & quicker to order from elsewhere.
    If I had an idea of how much of each type of liquid you wanted to order, then I might have a better idea of where you should order from to save $ & time.
     
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  16. Gabby

    Gabby Member

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    Sep 3, 2016
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Yeah I know, but I'm still in the fiddling stage. I'm currently looking at Fasttech which I've used before (with the Singapore Post option), a bit slow but I'm not in a great hurry. Not much to lose there anyway.
     
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  17. Noe

    Noe Adorably quirky ... QUIRKY Noe! VCA Approved Post Whore

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    If using FT, consider upgrading the shipping to expedited (costs approx $3 Au) you should get your package within 2 weeks, rather than 4 weeks.
     
  18. Gabby

    Gabby Member

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    Sep 3, 2016
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    The computer says no. Or rather "Australia Expedited Air - cannot ship liquids" (greyed out). PITA!
    OK, I've made the order now we wait.
     
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  19. Gabby

    Gabby Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2016
    Location:
    Adelaide
    I'll certainly try this, emu. Thanks.
    I'm not very impressed with the flavours I've tried so far. The first one which I bought here (somewhere) is "Original Smoke Juice - Tobacco" which is quite mild flavoured and the best I've tasted. The others are a bit too much for me - too strong, too sweet.

    And thanks to all others who've responded, especially Noe. I had no idea it was such a labyrinth.
     
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  20. The Vaper

    The Vaper I Vape ∴ I Am

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    Location:
    Sydney 2016
    I started with 80/20 PG/VG. I gradually drifted to 50/50 but same here, I get a heavy chest. Now I've played with 90/10 (first time I ever saw a Silo Beast give a dribble) and settled back into 80/20.
     
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